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4231 means little press. Might be a good thing as our press got no where near them after 20 minutes of the first game.
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Which is why Ed I keep on about preparation. We visibly play with a slower tempo against a lot of teams and the results are poor. We up the tempo we play well. A few seasons ago we only played high tempo and smashed teams ledt right and centre. Things have changed this year and its what I have moaned about all season.
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“Today yet another reminder to Utd and Ten Hag just how awful we must have been to get spanked like that against Liverpool.”
Little bit disrespectful to be honest, it’s not like we are always shit. We played very well against Utd in that 2nd half and utd got what they deserved. Besides the whole “you beat them and they beat us” whatever argument never makes sense as anyone can beat anyone on their day. Utd were outclassed on that day, massively, today we underperformed.
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Ed you need to ask why Liverpool are good at Utd and City but terrible against lesser ability teams. I’m a firm believer that it’s the way they are set up, how they prepare during the week. I get the feeling they feel the need to pass around a low block so use possession tactics and lower tempo whilst against City and Utd its back to the tactics that brought Liverpool and Klopp success.
Said it many times there’s usually a reason why players play crap and that usually stems from the training pitch. We don’t have the players for possession tactics.
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Knew we were in trouble when I saw the two kids in midfield. There are both talented with great futures but who is the one to instigate the press? Not the senior player Fabinho who reverted back to the 76 year old we known too often this season.
Having said that it wasn’t all down to the midfield. Too casual by far. It’s like we can only play at 100% or nothing. This slower pace style makes certain players far too relaxed and lazy. Happened many times this season its not a coincidence we make stupid casual mistakes when out tempo drops.
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That’s a shocker of a half from VvD at both ends of the pitch. Midfield now none existent and our forwards have barely touched the ball in the last 30 minutes.
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To be honest I dont really get the whole xG thing. Take Liverpools recent beating from Madrid, I know we were actually good for about 20 minutes but we ended the game with a higher xG than Madrid despite being walloped.
Liverpool (2.09) 2-5 (1.66) Real Madrid
— The xG Philosophy (@xGPhilosophy) February 21, 2023
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Individually Thiago has been our best midfielder this season, but he’s not been part of the best midfield combination.
I go on about it a fair bit but the team system is far more important than individuals and if it means dropping or axing Thiago for the greater benefit of the team then so be it.
It could be that Thiago is better suited to facing low block teams when we need to move the ball quickly from side to side. Horses for courses.
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Who had concerns about the midfield before yesterday’s game? I know Nil did he questioned Elliot. Here’s a crazy stat for you:
Henderson, Fabinho and Elliot have started 5 games together this season and all five have been won with a goal ration of 28-2.
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Sean you’re right about Liverpool play well when Fab plays well but look in detail at the midfield and you’ll see why Fabinho has improved. They are all a lot closer and the Trent underlap/Henderson out to the wing thing seems to have been abandoned. When we lost possession that tactic left us so wide open and Fabinho acres of space to cover when running isn’t his strong point! Much tighter and much better team pressing.
Nunez looked a bit subdued in the first half I assumed the effects of the shoulder injury but he is looking good on the left. You said previous that he needs to be closer to the goal but I disagree, look at what Salah does from a similar position on the right. With Gakpo really taking the Bobby role well it gives both wide players plenty of space to use their pace and Nunez has buckets of that.
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Hearing the Fernandes asked to be subbed off, is this true? And he was captain wasnt he?
At the end of the besides a bit of a hammering to the goal difference its just a loss at a place where most teams struggle. Utd are still having a very good season, especially after the last few and will return to the CL next season which must have been their target. They havn’t been in the title race this season and any talk of that was just foolish giddy comments from ex-players but they have shown signs they could be in the mix next season.
We clicked and everything fell into place. It happens, especially at Anfield.
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HUGE!!!
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Arsenal score in the 60th minute and the Bournemouth keeper goes down with cramp! Just before Partey scored Ben White does a comical throw himself to the floor trying to get a pen I guess.
Quite entertaining this…
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Wow Arsensl, you’re going to Spurs this up!
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Nil: BBC News – Loud bang prompts calls to Leicestershire Police
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-leicestershire-64847214_____________________________
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Personally couldn’t care less if our right sided attacker is our main goal threat as opposed to a no 9, or our right back is the chief playmaker as opposed to a midfielder. Is all about the team. Why I rolled my eyes at comments like we need more goals or creativity from midfield when we were blowing every team away already.
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Think Rodgers played him on the left wing at first?!
A great player, one that I think is underrated and misunderstood by many who didn´t watch him like Liverpool fans. Things like he needs to score more, Liverpool would be a better team with a 30 goal a season guy there etc, without realising we had a 30 goal a season guy on the right wing and one of the main reasons he scored so many was Firmino.
In his prime a couple of seasons ago he was simply a joy to watch. High level of skill, work rate and team work combined.
Hope he goes to a team that plays in the CL so we have a chance to meet him (big if we get into the CL!).
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“Who’s the Referee I wonder? Hope no Paul Tierney. Anthony Taylor, not sure; as soon as he goes to view the monitor, he’ll reverse his decision lol”
It’s Andy Madley apparently who is from Huddesfield. Tierney or Taylor would have been a nightmare.
Sean the team did well with Jota for a short time but not as well as most expected/wanted, hence the negative comments towards him. Personally I wouldn’t use that as a barometer of a successful tactic.
If you play 433 with a high intensity press playing an advanced forward means you lose him to press the DM. This then means one of the middle 3 has to do IT, leaving you man light in middle. With a deeper no 9 you effectively have 4 players pressing in the middle.
Advance forward works well as the focal point of attack in a 4231 which it seems the guys over at TT are all demanding but that would leave massive questions over the likes of TAA and Salah (who has always switched to the no 9 when we played 4231 as there’s no space for his type of AMR) and questions about the press. This is why I questioned signing Nunez as i dont want to switch to a 4231, but with Gakpo playing the deeper no 9 the 433 looks good giving nunez space to run in to.
My biggest gripe this season is we’ve not looked like a high intensity pressing 433 or a possesion based 4231 but with a little bit of both mixed together to create a complete mess of a tactic.
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Sean you’ve mentioned Jota before but I remember a lot of critism when he played central because of his lack of involvement or inability to press well so not sure why you use that as an example. Things along the lines of if he isn’t scoring (and he doesnt much for for a while) what else does he do?
In the past we never when full throttle for the full 90 minutes it’s impossible to keep up but we did for much longer than now. We still spend too much time with slow, ponderous passing. We saw in the last game when we do go more direct we get rewards, Salah’s goal and the disallowed Nunez one.
The players do seem a lot tighter together than a few weeks ago which might explain the upturn in the defence. When players come back into form or vice versa there’s usually a good reason why.
Need to be fired up from the first minute and abandon this slow possesion style or keep to a minimum when the players need a breather or to wear Utd out a bit.
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Was going to say a utd win based on form but after seeing Sean’s predictions and his track record with them it’s now nailed on for a Liverpool win.
If Liverpool can play with intensity, like with have done against City for example but all too infrequent this season, then we can win.
I questioned their signings at the time but I’m starting to like the Nunez and Gakpo roles, albeit in positions you’d associate with the other. Whether they were signed to play like this or Klopp stumbled across it when looking for solutions I don’t know but it’s working well. Maybe it’s more obvious now to others why I questioned an advanced forward (Nunez) in the no 9 position compared to a deeper striker (Bobby but also now Gakpo) in a 433.
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