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I think Gomez’s greatest asset is his pace which is obviously critical to a side like ours that plays a high line so that he can quickly chase back. Van Dijk is the more commanding without question. I wonder if the question mark with Gomez is whether he’s started to get a bit cocksure of himself and perhaps Klopp has seen this and something in his attitude which is why he’s maybe looking for someone else, if the rumours are true.
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Nine, that might be my fault ?, though I do think it points to where the club is at.
Ed, to actually get into the CL under Klopp, the club didn’t overspend. Then they invested further once in it, but most importantly, had the right man and right plan in place, something they’d not really had in the many years before of being in the CL. The situation at Spurs and Arsenal is well documented on.
As for Maguire, I’m not here to lynch the guy or call him a bad player. But if a top club pays £80 million on a player then they can’t just be a “bridge the gap” player to the club going from top 5 to title winners, they need to be more than that, regardless of whether he does improve the team. It just isn’t the action of a club targeting the big prizes, more of a desperate one acting out of fear of missing CL money. And rarely does something good come out of acting out of fear. As I say even if you do make the CL, the CL as I’ve said for many times becomes a corrupting influence as the CL ends up using the club rather than the other way around, and the money can actually end up burning a hole in your pocket.
Sometimes a club just needs to fall down for it to get up again. The CL acts like a distraction that masks the deeper problems at a club and prolongs its misery. So bizarrely, I think a team like Arsenal, if they identify the right players in, could actually be a better bet for success in a few years time.
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Neither Liverpool or Spurs overspent to get into the CL.
As for Maguire being “considered good business with the longer term strategy in mind.“
What *is* the longer term strategy? Keep the club in the CL and the revenues coming in? Sure. But time and time again at Liverpool all I heard for a long time was “get into the CL to take the next step”…which never came.
Maguire is the symptom here not the cause. As we’ve said time and time again, Man Utd need a plan and the right manager. Years ago I saw Mourinho as the natural successor to Fergie. But the club passed up on it and than made a mess of it when they did appoint him. And unfortunately that legacy will affect the club for some time yet.
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Reposted above Ed but broken up into two. It disappeared after editing it. I find it helps if you break the post up after such things happen. Don’t know if anyone else has had such a problem.
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Remember, this is a key time for Utd. If they don’t land a league title within a few years that will be 10 years without a title. And 10 years then becomes 20 years, and so on as the clubs winning mentality keeps subsiding.
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I think my point on Maguire comes from being a Liverpool fan over our long barren period. Before you know it you start accepting more average players which are accepted because it’s said they are “needed”. This can be how top teams start decaying. Would Fergie have signed Maguire for that price? I don’t think he ever would. Then the argument comes that “needs must” but as I say, that’s where it becomes a slippery slope. When Liverpool were buying players in recent years from a position of mediocrity, they were targeting players in key positions of a very high quality from Mane to Salah to VVD to Alisson. And Klopp was prepared to wait for the right player rather than desperately bringing someone in. Even if Maguire does help Man Utd back into the CL, are they going to set the competition alight next season? What kinds of players are they going to target? And most importantly, what is their plan? As Threeps said, their strategy and system doesn’t seem coherent with the type of player Maguire is. The CL music may help to mask over such things, but it’s extremely easy to become a yo-yo CL club who end up standing still and not progressing as the target simply becomes “getting into the CL”.
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Test
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Quite so Sean – last season is where the bar is – both us & City conceded 22 & 23 goals respectively. Man Utd are on course to concede about 37 goals this season which isn’t far off the 42 goals Liverpool conceded in 2016/17 which was considered too high, hence the targeting of Van Dijk & Alisson.
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If Maguire is a “means to an end”, then that’s fair enough (though the season ain’t over yet, and no targets have been achieved yet). Man Utd probably one of very few clubs that could afford to pay over the odds for him. But I still think you’ll need to replace him if Utd are to win the big prizes again.
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Problem is at CB & GK, you’re more exposed in those positions. If Henderson played in one of those positions, I don’t think he would have lasted. As for Kepa, I’ve seen a good amount of stick banded around about him. But for some reason his record transfer at Chelsea seemed to go under the radar at the time, perhaps because Alisson has just signed for Liverpool and took more of the headlines as the club was back at the top. Maguire being an English player certainly soaked up a lot of the headlines when he moved last year.
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Maguire also ain’t an £80 mil CB, but I think everyone knew that.
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De Gea is becoming a liability Ed, that’s the problem. Sad to see from his personal point of view.
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Ed, on the point about Ighalo, it just goes to show you don’t need huge bucks to find an effective player for you. And indeed, the best player a club can sign is the most effective one as opposed to the supposedly best one who may not work as well in other systems, and we’ve all seen the money wasted over the years. I’ve always wondered over the years how many lost souls there are out there who have failed to be found and so realised their potential. When we went in for Andy Robertson, I think the only other club interested were Stoke. Yet Liverpool obviously saw something in him they knew would suit both us and him. But most clubs don’t want to take the risk and feel better bringing in a more established name.
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The concern is that as Rob has pointed out on TT, the results since the home game at Atletico have been poor: Won 5, Drawn 2, Lost 6 in all competitions. For 18, Against 20. I think we saw yet again last night how we can struggle to break teams down. I was getting really frustrated with some of the full backs lazy balls into the box which were more like desperate hit and hope balls than anything, though TAA was more guilty than Robertson. Salah poor again last night, Mané looked the only bright spark. If we don’t bring in competition or better creativity, this success I don’t think will be very sustainable. It all just looks rather tired.
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Mak, and we know damn well City wouldn’t be doing this in the same position – they’d still be blowing sides away!
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Given that we’ll be given the trophy straight after the Chelsea game, you’d think we’d want to lift it on a high…
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Agree Sean, I was puzzled by Keita’s absence from the starting line-up. He’s going to be more full of beans too. Hell, I’d even play Jones too. Looks like most of the first team have just got a bit cock sure of themselves.
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Thank you for all your hard work Ed.
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Chelsea have a leaky defence, the worst in the top 10, which is worrying.
Rodgers is still tactically naive for me at Leicester.
Man Utd look the form team at the moment but it is only just that, good form._____________________________
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And before anybody thinks I sympathise with rich clubs or the state of money in the game, I don’t. I have despaired for decades about the nature of money in the game, but am simply saying that you can’t really point the finger of blame at owners like the City owners. They are just opportunists who are acting in a manner encouraged by the new culture we now have. If we are to start looking for people to blame probably one person to start with I think is one Murdoch who changed the nature of the game all those years ago with the advent of the premier league. We are now witnessing his legacy. Very similar to the legacy of Ecclestone with regards to F1 in my opinion.
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