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What you reckon lads?
Fair enough on his opinion of fergie. I get the feeling neville is spot on though and keane the manager would have kicked out keane the player.
I think totally out of order with comments on walters though considering his circumstances, keano should not be punching down on someone like this imo
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On one hand, you have to admire a man who is always completely honest (despite his “bluntness”), but then again, KEANO the man has always been a fair bit of a plumsack in his own write for numerous reasons (personally, going out and intentionally hurting another player is lowest of the low in my humble opinion, no matter how good a player he was).
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I think he thinks he is being honest, but when you see his calm and composed nature here (even when being really nasty), and then consider how explosive, angry and confrontational he has always reportedly been, I am not sure if he is all there when these things happen, I think he loses it and I am really suspicious of his version of any of this.
He talks about making it as a manager still, no chance imo.
As for fergie’s treatment of him, a 34 yr old legend he may have been, but the negatives completely outweighed the positives with keane at that stage of his career and its no surprise fergie kicked him out and made example of him in front of the players he relied on to take utd forward imo.
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Watched the longer version where Gary Neville says that Keane and Fergie were basically the mirror of each other – principled, ruthless, stubborn, etc, which is why when they clashed, it got pretty heated.
I think that whilst Keane just says a lot of things in terms of how they are and doesn’t give a rats (which can be refreshing when others try and tiptoe around things), it’s his uncompromising nature that is both his strength and weakness.
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I’ve a lot of respect for Keane the player. I think we all understand why this didn’t convert to success in management but if he can mellow out a bit, he might have some potential there. I don’t see it though.
I will say though in my opinion, he was wrongfully made a scapegoat for a disastrous World Cup in 2002 (I think it was?), by a disgraceful FAI. To the non-Irish lads on here, Keane is despised by most of the country and even some here in Cork too, for this very reason.
basically what happened is the FAI (our Football association) decided that the WC was about their enjoyment experience first and the actual participation second. I don’t remember exact details but preparations for the team were apparently non-existent, with flights, training, food and hotels for the team being nickel and dimed down to an embarrassing level. Out of everyone, Keane was the only one who stood up and said that this wasn’t good enough. The board members flew first class while the players were sent coach. The pre-match food was apparently sandwiches and the training ground they were given was said to be a very very poor surface. Apparently it wasn’t actually a pitch at all but who knows.
While I can definitely respect Keane in this kind of situation (unlike most Irish people I think), I’m not sure that i would like him personally. I don’t rank players by their personalities though but more in what they did on the pitch and Utd player or not, Irish outcast or not, Keane was one of the best PL players of all time.
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Totally agree mak, one of the greatest players in prem history, and probably the greatest captain.
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Great player. Absolutely bang out of order about what he did about Walters crying
Wasn’t on any side when Keane left the squad in 02.
Both had valid points. Chap is an aashole but great to listen to
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Mak, from what I remember of the 2002 incident, Keane didn’t like the fact that the FIA officials had the best seats on the plane and the fact they had to go through the airport checks like joe public has to. Absolutely no justification for a moan there at all.
He did however have a point that the training facilities they went to were substandard.
There are ways though of making a point, stamping your feet, spitting your dummy out and going home wasn’t probably the best way to do it…..Pagan
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Pagan, I’ll have to say that I strongly disagree and I would say that modern science also disagrees with your position that he didn’t have justification to “moan”. I don’t like the use of this term as it is inherently suggestive of a complaint for complaint sake.
Flying in cramped situations is not good for the average person. It causes circulation problems and even besides that the extra comfort for such a long flight (Ireland to Japan) is the difference between the players being reasonably well rested and being exhausted when they touch down. So, I say there are very strong grounds for a complaint. Further on this, it is indicative of the FAI’s priorities.
“stamping your feet, spitting your dummy out and going home wasn’t probably the best way to do it”
This never happened. Keane confronted them, I think after he saw the training and dietary efforts and threatened to leave. My memory is foggy as to what happened then but I think they convinced him to stay but things didn’t change and there was another flare up, leading to Keane calling McCarthy a cunt, or something strong and he was then SENT home.
There was a bit of a smear campaign that came from all of this (in my opinion) and Keane came out worst but what i do not understand is how people haven’t lost their minds at the FAI. I tell you this, I would have had the exact same problems with the PATHETIC Irish setup as Keane. I’d have confronted them and if it came to it, I’d call that cunt and cunt too. He was and is our manager again. It is surely his responsibility, in part, to make sure that things are up to a certain standard. He’s in their boys club though seemingly, back in for another run.
To me, the FAI showed up the Irish on the global stage. We definitely do not have a reputation for being a professional type of people and this utter shame really embarrassed us, perpetuating this image of the dodgy Irishmen *wink wink nudge nudge*.
Could Keane have acted better, absolutely. Was he the party in the wrong though? Nope, I give him maybe 5% of the blame. If the FAI made even half an effort in creating an environment that was conducive to getting the best out of our lads then he shuts up and does his job.
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Neville was a laugh in this. He seems so laid back now since quitting pro-football.
That in itself should tell you how much of a regiment and a control freak Ferguson was.
That said, they were god damn successful and many would argue and is completely understandable in how and why Fergie was the way he was. Nobody was bigger than United and Beckham was another that was shown the door.
Keane is Keane, but for somebody the way he was treated (allegedly) with a Bib thrown at him by Carlos Queiroz during Training and the meeting with Alex and David Gill, you can understand the grievance.
I do understand too, if Families are invited over with players, then they want a bit of their own space and wouldn’t necessarily want to be staying in the same resort as the Club Manager or other Team mates. It’s nothing personal, but maybe Keane felt a bit under the thumb under Fergie, and he is ultimately his own man.
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I would add, the point of seeing it from different Personnel and different levels of Authority.
Player-Captain-First Team Coach-Assistant Manager-Manager-Chairman-Chief Executive/Owner
The challenge at the best of times is to mesh and try to just fulfil your own position whilst trying to keep a Happy Medium all round.
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Mak, I think footballers are overpaid pri maddonas who have a self importance beyond belief, it’s not as if they were expected to jump of the plane and play a match. For me a true professional takes adversity in their stride and overcomes it, uses it in a positive manner.
Yes the Irish FA were probably not up to scratch in comparison to other FAs, but that’s the way it is, They don’t have the same resources as England, that’s why the The talented Irish players go to England. It really shouldn’t have been a surprise to him….Pagan
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Footballers in the industry of that level and ilk of that age, have Time On Their Hands which could be deemed as dangerous, if one is thinking spending his afternoon down the Pub.
I get why Ferguson’s self consciousness to keep Players together. To some degree, if I was in his shoes, I’d be doing the same.
There is a lot of Responsibility that your Personal Secretary is only able to be there for to his/her own Remit.
Of course, you can’t wrap players up in a Cocoon. I just think it came down to simply being told what to do or to put into an analogy, taught to suck eggs. Keane wasn’t ultimately having any of it.
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Keane was always a brave man sometimes stupid but had the guts to stand up to an old rogue
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Pagan, I think we’ll have to agree to disagree but it was a good discussion 😉
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Pagan I will add that i agree with you regards footballers thinking too highly of themselves. The thing is though, it isn’t their fault. I can only imagine how hard it would be to not get carried away with things. If you’re a very successful superstar footballer, you’re being engulfed in praise just by walking down the street.
You won’t catch me saying “think of the poor footballers!”, their lives are far better than mine. I’ll never be as financial stable as any of them. I’m just saying that were we to be cast into their shoes, we’d soon see all the pitfalls of mega fame.
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