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I’ve already argued against VAR in an earlier post and I think it was only Pagan who agreed with me and was against it.
But last night summed up it’s problems…while it is being used for sorting out decisions that are subjective, like penalty decisions, diving etc it is fraught with problems. Limit it to the things it can decide definitively like offside, and leave the subjective decisions to the guy on the field. Nobody has aclue what is going on at the moment
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Football, as an organised sport has been around for C150 years, it’s the biggest sport on the planet, the most written about sport, the most talked about sport, every where you go you can talk footy. Why? Because of opinions and the controversy it causes, so what do we do, try and remove those and make into a sterile game, yes you get bad decisions, and sometimes it hurts when your team is on the receiving end but, when it comes to the sport as whole I stand by the phrase “if it’s not broke, don’t mend it” ….Pagan
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To be honest, everyone was admitting the Willian one was a penalty. and the ref missed it. or may be the Pedro dive may have played part. Pedro was rightfully booked . Morata was was unlucky that kind of of contact should have been a foul outside the box. but that said i would have liked Morata to stay his feet. i was more angry with my team than the referee and the VAR referee. i was disappointed with our performance. this was the kind of opposition that we should have practiced for our shooting.
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“The video referee who failed to overturn the key decision in Chelsea’s controversial FA Cup tie did not get to see the super-slow-motion replay that viewers at home were shown, it can be revealed.
Chelsea forward Willian should have been awarded a penalty after being tripped by Norwich’s Timm Klose in Wednesday’s third-round replay but was instead booked by referee Graham Scott for diving.
Those watching on the BBC saw a super-slow-motion replay that showed Klose made contact with Willian.
The video referee has access to 12 camera angles but does not see what is being broadcast on TV or listen to commentary in case it influences him.
But video referee Mike Jones, who watched the incident more than 10 times on his monitors at Stockley Park in west London, did not have access to those pictures so could not correct the decision.
Those in charge of the video technology trials feel this was their first significant error and accept it is a work in progress.
The Professional Game Match Officials Ltd (PGMO) did not wish to comment but insiders know the Willian incident should have been overturned — and believe it would have been had Jones seen the super-slow-motion replay.” Kieran Gibb article in the Daily Mail 19/1/2018.
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I think at this point, there should be a cut-off point. I just find this a little over embellished.
An inquest now just because Willian wasn’t awarded a Pen?
Is this seriously what this games come to now?
I really need a different thread (Sigh).
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NB, it’s not new, fans of football clubs keep banging on about things that have happened in the past is it?.. Pagan
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Nil, this isn’t about Willian not being awarded a penalty it’s about VAR its potential problems and where it goes from here.
Up until the last 24 hours nobody knew that the VAR monitoring the game at Stockley Park didn’t see the same TV pictures as the rest of us and didn’t have Super SLO mo available to him.
This is a thread based forum mate if you don’t want to read comments on a particular thread its very easy to just skip by that thread.
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They do see the same pictures. There is only one set of cameras. What they don’ See is what is shown in the BBC or Sky TV etc.
They get the exact same feed, from the same cameras and monitor those.
Which of the camera angles they choose to review the incident with is up to them. They do not have the TV producer choosing the feed for them.
Part of the issue with the Willian incident was that the pictures were not replayed on slow motion. They need to learn that, but on the other hand if you needed slow motion it was not clear and obvious.
Swings and roundabouts. It’s not perfect and it’s in a trial period. They will learn.
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Pagan, true. There’s nostalgia, and then there’s dwelling on a Penalty Decision that’s not going to be overturned. We’ve had a shed load of decisions go against us, I could give you a long list 🙂
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Alfie, spot on.
And here’s the thing which itself is ‘damn if you do and damn if you don’t’:
There’s moans of this all being time consuming and holding up the game, yet, there is what I feel excess time spent in the Studio after the game by Pundits ‘reviewing’ and ‘analysing’ the incident from several different camera angles.
The DNA of a Referee is to take one maybe two looks or get hold of one or two different opinions, make his decision and move on swiftly to maintain the flow of the match. It’s ultimately not his accountability if a team is Relegated or a team doesn’t make it to the Champions League.
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NB, how does a ref get one or two looks and different opinions. A ref gets one look from one angle and had to make his own decision. That’s the whole point of VAR.
NB, you spend hours on here giving your opinions, the only differences between you and a pundit are they get paid and they have a bigger audience.
I don’t want VAR, as I believe it will remove the vast majority of talking points from the game, and it’s the those that keep forums like this going….Pagan
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Exactly, Pagan, I’m a mug. I’m a mug for spending hours and hours giving my opinions and receiving nothing in return. My free-time or downtime is wasted earning zilch.
VAR is not about keeping the candle lit for talking points, it’s about assisting and supporting Referee’s to make an accurate call.
What I was trying to say is that the Ref is afforded a second opinion from the Linesman and another from the 4th official.
I don’t know what processes are in place as it’s pretty much all sketches at the moment in trial and error.
I’m just annoyed that some people out there are loosely just wanting to write off an idea before it’s even been allowed a real opportunity of a breakthrough. They can moan for another 15 years if that’s what they feel satisfies them as ‘talking points’.
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NB, the assistant ref, is obviously there to assist, the 4th official is there to do the off field duties and be a back up should the ref no longer be able to continue his duties.
Don’t put yourself down as a mug, I was just saying talking points are what makes football more than a 90 minutes a week hobby/interest/obsession, I just think VAR will make the game to sanitised, and once it’s in there will be no turning back, eventually it will end up being reffed remotely with video screens and a tannoy system….Pagan
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Nil, As I said in my previous posts to you “that’s the problem mate it all still comes down to human error. I would say ultimately we will be better off with VAR than without it but it is never going to be full proof.”
“To be fair the reason that VAR is going through this trial period it is, is to iron out the kinks in it and yesterday’s incident hopefully might help towards doing that. Last night was not such an important game but you wouldn’t want it happening in a CL Final for instance and changing the course of a game the wrong way.”
As per what I said above I’m not looking to write VAR off but no Super SLO mo as compared to what we all saw on Wednesday night needs to be addressed and I think it will be during the trial period. Cheers 999
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Nine fair points mate.
Referee’s are under a lot of pressure and microscope at the moment. This is just my own point of view, but other than Howard Webb and Mark Halsey, I’m not really keen on hearing the input of ex-Referees.
I don’t think too certain studio pundits and that goes for the radio too have been particularly supportive so far of the technology and the refs. Just feel as though no matter what they try and do, they are castigated.
I sincerely hope though something in good can come out of this new facility and this Sport can be perceived in a more better light that projects a fair game.
Cheers
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Nil, I agree mate and have always said Refs do a tough job and have to make decisions in seconds that we get to see from a 100 different angles and in slo mo one hundred times over.
I’ve done it in the parks with kids teams and it’s not easy and can only imagine how tough it is given the circumstances that Refs have to face in a Stadium holding sometimes upwards of 60,000 having to make immediate decisions.
Clearly no super slo mo is a disadvantage to the VAR sitting in Stockley Park and hopefully given what happened on Wednesday night and how the PGMO have seen it and reacted to it they will look to ensure that’s something that the VAR has to call on going forwards and like you I’m for anything that might help the Referee’s. Cheers 999
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People thought when var cane in then it be disappointing we would not be able to debate any decisions lol. Doesn’t look like that.
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Pity we didn’t have VAR back in 2005, to have confirmed Luis Garcia’s ‘ghost goal’
Ha ha
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Beni, true enough but it would have ruined an historical CL Final.?
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Thought the ref got the decaions spot on with the help of VAR in the Liverpool West Brom game tonight. Sure it needs some tweeting, decisions need to be quicker and i think the replays should go on tbe big screens. But I actually think the players and managers will come to like it once it’s all sorted. I also think it will end up with the refs being shown more respect and enable them to have better games.
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