Let's try and help Referees once and for all with realistic ideas/solutions

[Nike19]

Wanted to get my teeth into this with a nice clear head; So I was thinking yesterday on the back of the controversy surrounding Mike Dean on his call for a Penalty re Callum Chambers.

I am sure to my knowledge I have been involved in these type of discussions probably since early to mid-millennium when there used to be Your On Sky Sports which was a Football Phone In.

It has to be well over a decade for me to have heard countless times, the word ‘consistency’ or Video Technology. Every new season and every message board I’ve been on I’ve came across nothing but repetition of comments and arguments.

I’m personally sick to the back teeth of at least a quarter of a phone-in being filled with the same nonsense than headway. It’s filling up unnecessary air time when more can be talked about the actual game.

It’s hypocrisy too to a certain degree because they know they can or try and resolve this, but then they point out “oh well we’ll haven’t nothing to discuss”.

It’s just appalling.

This is what I would put forward as ideas/proposals:

1) Give each 2 calls to challenge any ‘wrongful’ decisions.

2) Place Cameras on each corner flag that will cover goal mouth right up to the 18 yard box and have somebody monitoring.

3) Educate by taking weekly ‘Hazard Perception’ type of tests and as a group, allow a voting system on the back of watching each incident. If you have the majority in agreement, this is what will promote consistency, regardless of the Ref and the fixture.

4) On Number 2, most importantly allow that guy on the Monitor to be able to challenge the Referee’s call to guide him to the correct decision against the letter of the law.

My only reasoning to how Mike Dean called it a hand ball was because he has a side wide of Chambers that looked as though he deliberately pulled out his arms to shield himself. But other camera angles and close ups prove otherwise and conclusively, it was a harsh decision made and this sort of thing has ramifications both affecting the top and the bottom half of the table.

That’s my 6 pence of this on the table, over to you guys.

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[Chucky McChuckface]

You forgot the biggest one of all my cyber chum, have both the players and the managers, OFF ALL CLUBS, stop bloody cheating…

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[Pagan]

Chuckles had summed it up perfectly, clubs and players need honesty and integrity, cheating should be a shameful and embarrassing thing to do, and that needs to come from the players own team and fans….Pagan

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[Pagan]

NB, not sure what you mean by point 4, correct decision against the letter of the law, care to elaborate….Pagan

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[nine nine nine]

I posted this on the Weekend football thread but it’s probably more appropriate on here as it provides an explanation as to how the diving panel works.

Terry Butcher, Lee Dixon and Danny Murphy are among the ex-players and managers tasked with dishing out two-match bans to divers this season – but there are no former strikers in the group.

The trio were joined by fellow ex-England internationals Trevor Sinclair, Chris Powell and Rachel Brown-Finnis in a Football Association pool that will review suspected cases of what is being called ‘successful deception of a match official’.

Butcher and Powell are two of four out-of-work managers, along with Alex McLeish and Nigel Adkins, appointed to a pool in which they are among two ex-goalkeepers, four ex-defenders and two ex-midfielders.

Each suspected case will be reviewed by a three-strong panel of one manager, one ex-player and one former referee, selected from Eddie Wolstenhome, Alan Wiley, Mike Mullarkey, Steve Dunn and Keren Barratt.

Panel members will not be able to sit in judgment on cases in which there may be a conflict of interest.
The FA introduced the new offence of ‘successful deception of a match official’ this summer as part of a crackdown on diving and feigning injury.

Incidents where a player is suspected of such cheating can only be examined if the offending team has been awarded a penalty or it has contributed to an opposing player being sent off.

Following an incident, each of the three appointed panel members will be asked to review footage of it independently of the other two.

Their verdict must be unanimous for a charge to be issued.

Should the charge be admitted, or denied and later found proven by an independent regulatory commission, the guilty player would receive a two-match suspension.

The FA’s rationale for the punishment is that although feigning injury and simulation is a cautionable offence when detected by the match officials, successfully deceiving those officials to secure a penalty and/or dismissal justifies a more severe sanction.

In the event that a charge is admitted or denied and later found proven, the independent regulatory commission shall consider whether or not to rescind an associated caution or dismissal received by an opposing player as a result of the simulation.

We’ll get a look at his VR might work in our game from the 3rd Round of the FA Cup where it will be active.

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[Pagan]

9, only in certain games though, which will be harsh on a team that goes out to cheating at a ground that doesn’t have the facilities, and somewhere else the VR saves a team.

I believe it’s also being used in the carabao cup semis, but not at Bristol’s ground..Pagan

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[nine nine nine]

Hhmm! didn’t realise that Pagan the Chelsea fan in me says I won’t be happy if it works against us and we go out on a VR decision but elsewhere someone else goes through in similar circumstances with no VR but the football fan in me says it’s got to start somewhere and perhaps it makes sense not to have blanket usage of it just yet.

Are you aware of the areas it’s being used fir.?

I guess it’s ” One small step for man one giant leap for mankind”. ?

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[Pagan]

9, I believe it will be used to see

whether a goal should stand, to see if there are any infringements leading up to it

Penalty decisions

Mistaken identity for cards both yellow and red

Red cards, this is only for straight reds, not second yellow offences

I also think it can only be used if it’s something really clear cut and obvious, not something that is debatable

…Pagan

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[Anonymous]

Technology is the only way. That’s the way the world has already moved. I can also understand why ref blew for a penalty even though it was unintentional. The ball hit him bang in the hand and his arms were not down ny his sides. Anyway that’s my view. The incident on the previous day when a more obvious penalty was not given was the real cause of the controversy.

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[Nike19]

Pagan, point 4 relates to whoever is monitoring the television can overrule or challenge the Referee’s call if he/she feels otherwise.

We need to think seriously about the VAR.

The diving instances can be sorted out by point number 3 – they just need to group together weekly and run through each incident.

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[nine nine nine]

Pagan, I think it should work pretty much like it does in Rugby where the Referee can call in the Video Ref if he needs him to analyse the footage for confirmation on a decision.

I don’t think you can have someone on a Monitor over ruling the Referee’s decisions and I don’t think the Football powers that be would ever sanction that. Cheers 999

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[Pagan]

Personally NB, I think the VR reviewer shouldn’t be able to overrule, but may suggest that the on field ref may want to have a look at the video of an incident, otherwise your just one step away from the game being reffed in a room full of monitors and a tanoy system.

Obviously the on field ref should also be able to ask to see video if he wants as well.

The only downside to this is the cost and manpower it requires as it would need to be done at all pro levels. Alternatively it’s not used for cup competitions to make a level playing field….Pagan

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[Nike19]

Pagan, that first line is spot on and I’m in full agreement of that. That’s the sensible and appropriate way of going about this.

It’s unlikely to be a constant stop-start and interjections, but this ultimately should only be on key decisions.

I don’t think on percentages we’re seeing Referees making half-a-dozen bad calls. Largely those contested are marginal and part and parcel of what makes our game great to watch.

Wouldn’t want the affair as you quite rightly point out robotic.

Cheers

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[nine nine nine]

Of course the problem with VR is that we will have different rules controlling football because due to costs if it is eventually adopted it’s unlikely to go down to all of the divisions.

Goal line technology doesn’t hit the Championship for instance until next season.

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[Pagan]

We have that already with the two extra assistants in European footy, I don’t see that as too much of an obstacle providing individual competitions are governed by the same rules, everything switched of for cup games….Pagan

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[nine nine nine]

Pagan it happens that way in Rugby with the TMO who is only involved in internationals and top club games.

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[Chelsea.man]

Now that Mike Dean has made that mistake. I won’t ve surprised in the referee is put under alot of pressure and gives some decisions in favour of Arsenal in our game on Wednesday. I’m more concerned about the football pundits crying foul. Which means it puts the next ref under scrutiny. And even when the referee is Mr Taylor??

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