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I read in twitter that Peps starting 11 against Madrid cost €720m
Ancelotti starting 11 cost €260m
Would Pep be a success if he was managing a side that cost €260m?
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He has the Management Skills, knowledge of the game and coaching ability. But in my eyes, the success can only be met with a certain deck of cards. Although if he inherited Klopp’s side, we’d be Champions and that is not any negativity towards Jurgen. So some degree bit not the example of let’s say a Jose.
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Pep is clearly a good tactician but he’s only every managed the best club in the land with the best resources. His first job was with probably the finest club team ever, talk about a lucky break!
He will never be fully recognised as one of the best ever PL managers like SAF, AW etc, but is undoubtedly good at implementing his style.
Edit: his CL success at City is pretty poor considering his team are always favorites.
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Nil-
Isn’t it telling that this is Klopp worse side in years, had to deal with so many injuries and yet he is still going toe to toe with Pep in the league?
City suffer when they lose Rodri and De Bruyne. Imagine if they had to deal with the same level of injuries as Klopp has done this season. Yet Klopp still has Liverpool challenging for the league.
Pep has never been in position where he has had to deal with long term injuries to more than 2 of his key players. That is because he has always had the best strength in depth the game has seen. If he had a depleted side, that is where your skills definitely come in to play.
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Bllody hell, cover me in flour and bake me for thirty-five minutes on a medium setting, not this old chestnut again… 🙂 🙂 🙂
And for desert, who’s better? Gerrard vs Lampard vs Hibbert vs Scholes!!!
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CM, sorry just seen your reply now (finished from work). I couldn’t agree with you any more mate. You are spot on. Look at the restrictions from FSG. We have to make our own money and grow from net profit. Pep’s Portfolio and CV otherwise illustrates the clubs he has managed in co-incidence carries wealth and resources.
I’m wrong from my earlier reply re Klopp. He turned us into Believers did wonders in examples of Firmino, Salah and Mane, former Front 3.
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Chelsea gradually getting better as the season goes on. It’s taken a while but was always going to given how many players they’d bought and the lack of cohesion in the team that I think that that would result in.
I think City have struggled to replace Mahrez and Gundogan and so have lost something even if they are still a good side.
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Wrong thread sorry.
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Arguing about the best manager is a bit like arguing about who’s the best heavy weight champ (I vote Iron Mike!) or Tennis player (I voter Roger!)… to many different ways to measure success and too many ways to argue against others…
It’s hard to argue who’s a better mamanger between a manager who takes over teams at the top of the table anyway yet keeps them there, winning trophy after trophy after trophy than a manager who takes over a team/club, maybe doesn’t when trophy after trophy, but perhaps gets them promoted a division, or maybe even two, but leaves the club/squad in a far better conditon than when he found it.
Hard for a manager who only takes over teams already at the top to prove to the masses…
And there are very few managers, certainly that I can think of, who have proven to be able to do both…
I mean, if Pepe came to us Spuds and lead us to a title or two, turning a bridesmaid into a bride, then he might be able to suggest his the greatest manager of all time… 🙂
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Klopp would probably be visit his Doctor managing Spurs Chucks 😉
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There have been many top managers who managed clubs like Dortmund, Aberdeen and Porto and had them compete against the elite.
When Ferguson took over Manchester United, they were in the relegation zone. He was offered the Spurs and Arsenal job at the time, who were in a much better position on and off the pitch and went with Manchester United due to the challenge.
Klopp had his Dortmund side competing after they were midtable for so many seasons. Having them reach a CL final. Went to Liverpool after rejecting Manchester United, had his Liverpool side go toe to toe against City, a side that spent 40m+ on almost every position.
Pep is an exceptional tactician, but I always felt he always takes the easy option, rather than a challenge. At the time he took over City, they had Kompany, Yaya, Silva, Fernandinho, Aguero. They won the league title with Pellegrini. Pellegrini went to West Ham and was sacked after they were in a relegation battle. What does that tell you?
My opinion on Pep is he always takes on challenges where he can build around a team, rather than build a team. Ten Hag has to build a side with a mentality of challenging, Pep wouldn’t want that challenge because it is a big risk for him, whilst Ferguson, Klopp would.
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That’s exactly my point, CM, but from a different view… (makes sense in my head!)…
In any “Greatest Manager” debate, Pepe can always point to his trophy cabinet and that’s hard to argue against… but as you say, he’s arguably always takent the “easier” route of only taking on top, top teams to start with and pretty much always having the biggest check-book around with at Barca (at the time), Munich (all the time) and City (so big it breaks 115 rulezz!!)… but we all know it’s more than just a big check book (look at Chelsea!)… even if a big check book helps immensely….
You mentioned Fergie, Klopp and Maureen taking “small” teams to the top (but it could also be argued with Klopp/Dortmund and Maureen/Porto that they were just a good couple of seasons as these clubs never “stayed” there after the managers left)… losing my point now, there was one I was trying to make but I’ve just woken up from my afternoon nap…. bit fuzzzzyyyy
And the end of the day, who are we actually saying is the greatest manager of all time?
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Like you say Banjo, debating who is the greatest will never be agreed on.
Paisley, Shankly, Busby, Ferguson, Jose, Pep, Jock Stein, Klopp all did things and won things in their own unique.
I believe the question was asked, would Pep be capable of competing with a line up that consistently cost 260m in today’s era compared to one that cost €700m.even after Madrid spends a fortune on Bellingham, they still managed to field a side thay cost 1/3 of Peps. I also read that Peps starting 11 yesterday cost over 100m more than Chelsea’s. This is them without Haaland and Gvardiol.
If everything was even financially for him, where would he be?
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Arguing about the money is just as mental… picking one the cost of one line-up and pitting it against the other… one line-up could have 2 x 20 million players from 6 years ago who could have costed 80 million last year for example… much was made about Liverpool’s “cost” when they beat Chelsea in the League Cup final… but as somebody pointed out at the time both Alison and I think Nunez were injured, and would have likely played if fit, in which case Pool’s starting 11 was more expensive than Chelsea’s starting 11… then much was made about bringing on the kids (who were in the squad based on injury to senior players, not like Kloop wanted to choose them)…
CM, it’s obvious you’re not a Pepe fan (and neither am I, to be honest, and I would agree with you he’s never really faced the challenge of building a side, just tinkering with a successful one)… but I’m starting to think you’re splitting hairs here trying to prove it… 🙂
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That’s where you’re wrong Banjo. I am a fan of Pep, I believe I have never seen a manager come in and have his sides dominate games the way they have done, but that only works to an extent. Wenger did it, but he never had the backing Pep has.
You being a Spurs fan, considering the limitations your club has on buying players. Who would you trust to challenge in today’s game? Klopp or Pep.
I would have Klopp because he has done it at Liverpool and Dortmund. That’s what I believe makes an elite manager.
I believe too much is made of Pep, when context is being taken out.
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If that’s the option, CM, then I’d go back a bit further and take Fergie… 🙂 but if under the currents Spuds “financial status” then I think Kloop would be a better fit…
Although, as much as Kloop hasn’t had the budget that Pepe has had, let’s not pretend he’s done everything at Poundland either… the Coutinho money sure spread a long way… 🙂
Just a few of the 895,000,000 million Kloop has apparently spent at Pool according to Mr. Goggle…
Sadio Mané Southampton £30,000,000
Georginio Wijnaldum Newcastle United £25,000,000 *
Mohamed Salah Roma £43,900,000
Andy Robertson Hull City £10,000,000
Alex Oxlade-Chamberlain Arsenal £35,000,000
Virgil Van Dijk Southampton £75,000,000
Naby Keita RasenBallsport Leipzig £52,750,000
Fabinho Tavarez AS Monaco £43,700,000
Alisson Becker Roma £65,000,000
Thiago Alcantara Bayern Munich £27,400,000
Diogo Jota Wolves £45,000,000
Ibrahima Konaté RasenBallsport Leipzig £36,000,000
Luis Diaz Porto £50,000,000
Darwin Nunez Benfica £85,360,000
Cody Gakpo PSV Eindhoven £44,000,000
Alexis Mac Allister Brighton & Hove Albion £35,000,000
Dominik Szoboszlai RasenBallsport Leipzig £60,100,000
Wataru Endo VfB Stuttgart £16,200,000
Ryan Gravenberch Bayern Munich £34,200,000_____________________________
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Don’t think you have got your numbers right there. A few of those transfer fees are wrong, for example:
Salah was £32 million not £43.9 million.
Robertson was £8m not £10m.
Fabinho was £39m not 43.7m.
Wijnaldum was £23m not £25m
Thiago was £20m not £27.4m
Diaz was £37.5m not £50mStill a lot of money but not as much as you say.
Also, Pep has changed how most Premier League sides play the game now. He is constantly coming up with new ways of playing and getting the best out of his team. He was the first to try the inverted full back (or centre half in John Stones) and no other team is playing 4 centre backs across a back 4! He is innovative, driven and an unbelievable manager. Yes he gets a lot of money to help him with this, but other managers have spent a lot of money and failed. Just look at Man United for the past 10-11 years! Spent an absolute fortune and have a starting 11 that maybe only 1 player would get in a top 6 side in Mainoo!
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